Discussion utilisateur:SuggestBot

A key part of SuggestBot is its "task categories", collections of articles that have been flagged with specific needs for improvements. An example category from English Wikipedia is "Add sources", which contains articles from four categories of work related to sources. SuggestBot uses these task categories because we do not want to suggest articles that do not need work.

The task categories are tailored for each Wikipedia. In the English Wikipedia, we have eight task categories based several underlying categories, the list is documented here. I have done a bit of research into French Wikipedia's categories, and found several candidates.

Add sources

There are several categories listed on Projet:Sources, but skip categories that do not contain articles clearly marked with a work description at the top.

Update

Catégorie:Article à mettre à jour

Orphan

Catégorie:Tous les articles orphelins

Wikify

Catégorie:Article à wikifier/Liste complète

Stubs

Traverse the category structure starting from Catégorie:Catégorie d'ébauche (this is similar to all the other Wikipedias we support)

There were some task categories we have in other languages that do not contain many articles in French. For instance Catégorie:Article à fusionner contains 148 pages, and Catégorie:Traduction incomplète contains 425 articles. Typically we tend to skip categories with low number of articles, because it is then less likely that the articles are related to a user's interests.

I am sure there are categories in the French Wikipedia that I have not found, because I do not know where to look. Please feel free to suggest candidates! Regards, Nettrom (discuter) 7 octobre 2015 à 01:02 (CEST)[répondre]

Pinging Trace, so they know about this thread. Cheers, Nettrom (discuter) 7 octobre 2015 à 01:05 (CEST)[répondre]

 Nettrom : waow! Great! Thank you for this work!

Some more categories:

Catégorie:Article à référence nécessaire is likely interesting : it contains pages without external references.

Same for Catégorie:Article à référence souhaitée: pages needing references.

And for Catégorie:Article manquant de référence: pages lacking of references!

This one is smaller but needs work : Catégorie:Article pouvant contenir un travail inédit. It contains pages that might contain original research.

This category contains only 551 pages Catégorie:Article BPV manquant de référence. It contains biographical pages without references.

This last one contains pages needing quotes: Catégorie:Article à citation nécessaire.

Hoping to help,

Trace (discuter) 7 octobre 2015 à 10:14 (CEST)[répondre]

Hi again Trace, and thank you for your help so far! I have spent some more time on these categories and would like to propose the following sets of tasks and categories:

Update

Catégorie:Article à mettre à jour

Orphan

Catégorie:Tous les articles orphelins

Wikify

Catégorie:Article à wikifier/Liste complète

Sources

Catégorie:Article manquant de référence/Liste complète, Catégorie:Article BPV manquant de référence, Catégorie:Article pouvant contenir un travail inédit, Catégorie:Tous les articles à prouver. See below for a discussion of the other source-related categories.

Unencyclopedic

Catégorie:Rédaction à améliorer

Verify

Catégorie:Article à vérifier (with subcategories)

Promotion/advertisement

Catégorie:Article au ton publicitaire

The categories used for "sources" do not include Catégorie:Article à référence nécessaire and Catégorie:Article à référence souhaitée. This is because these categories contain articles where it might not be easy to understand what improvements are needed. An example article is 17e arrondissement de Paris, where it is not clear what needs to be done. Instead, we prefer articles that have templates at the top (or in sections) that make it clear what/where work is needed. We have previously had this problem on both English and Norwegian Wikipedias, where long articles with a single ^{[citation needed]} were suggested and users struggled to find out how to improve them. I then spent several minutes digging through logs, wikitext, and categories to figure it out!

Keep in mind that this is just a proposal. If for obvious reasons these are not good suggestions, please do let me know. And we can of course always add or remove task categories or related categories later. Regards, Nettrom (discuter) 13 octobre 2015 à 01:05 (CEST)[répondre]

@Nettrom, @Like tears in rain, @Scoopfinder, @Simon Villeneuve et @Linedwell : Nettrom, your example is perfect. This article would be confusing for anyone goodwilling to help : nothing shows where the help is mostly needed. I agree to your list. And ping the others. Thank you for your support to our community. Trace (discuter) 13 octobre 2015 à 19:01 (CEST)[répondre]

I am convinced by your example and explanation. Thanks for your support. Linedwell ^[discuter] 13 octobre 2015 à 19:04 (CEST)[répondre]

Alright for me — SF ^(d) 14 octobre 2015 à 17:37 (CEST)[répondre]

Pulling this back to the left margin, hope that's okay. I've configured the categories and collected articles, and all contain a reasonably large number of articles:

Next, I will make a new section with a list of pages and phrases that I will need help getting translated. Should be ready later today. Cheers, Nettrom (discuter) 17 octobre 2015 à 18:11 (CEST)[répondre]

 Like tears in rain, Scoopfinder, Simon Villeneuve et Linedwell : vous avez récemment témoigné de votre intérêt pour Suggestbot. Il est désormais sur notre wikipédia, mais il est inactif : avez-vous à lui proposer d'autres catégories de travail que celles ci-dessus ? Trace (discuter) 7 octobre 2015 à 10:12 (CEST)[répondre]

 Trace : Je proposerais bien Catégorie:Article manquant de référence pour les articles en manque de sources. Je n'ai pas d'autre idée pour l'instant. Linedwell ^[discuter] 7 octobre 2015 à 11:03 (CEST)[répondre]

 Trace : Est-ce qu'il est possible d'activer pour moi le système de propositions en fonctions des pages éditées ? Sinon, pas de souci pour des catégories de maintenance même si un test connexe avec une catégorie thématique précise (Paris au hasard) serait intéressant. Like tears in rain ^{-_-} 7 octobre 2015 à 11:14 (CEST)[répondre]

 Linedwell : j'ai proposé Catégorie:Article manquant de référence ci-dessus.

 Like tears in rain : là, malheureusement, c'est à Utilisateur:Nettrom qu'il faut demander ; il me semble que le robot se base sur l'historique de tes contributions.

Trace (discuter) 7 octobre 2015 à 11:19 (CEST)[répondre]

Effectivement j'ai dû loucher pour ne pas la voir dans la liste. Linedwell ^[discuter] 7 octobre 2015 à 12:12 (CEST)[répondre]

To finish getting SuggestBot ready for French Wikipedia, there is a bit of translation work needed. I've prepared a table listing the pages that need translation, and another table with a few internal configuration settings SuggestBot has that I'd like help with, and three questions I have about SuggestBot's configuration. Please let me know if there are questions, and I'll do my best to help out!

Page	Translated?	Notes
Utilisateur:SuggestBot	Oui	nothing to translate here, IMHO
Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Requête
Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Souscrire
Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Boîte utilisateur	Oui
Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Modèles/Requêtes	Oui	This template is subst'ed. All the text needs to be translated, but not the template parameters as they are only for internal use.
Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Modèles/Souscriptions	Oui	Same as for the requests template.

SuggestBot uses Utilisateur:SuggestBot/suggest and Utilisateur:SuggestBot/config for requesting suggestions (single-time and subscriptions, respectively), but when used as templates, these pages do not produce any output and only contain a reference to the documentation, as noted above.

 Nettrom : as the page Utilisateur:SuggestBot/suggest does not contain the string "Request", I hardly understand where to update the new name of the page.

You have to keep in mind we don't know how to use Suggestbot. I translated some strings, but I don't understand some others. I asked for the help of the other french users, also to translate documentation pages.

Some translations:

Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Request > Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Requête or Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Demande

Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Subscribe > Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Souscrire or Utilisateur:SuggestBot/S'abonner

Utilisateur:SuggestBot/userbox > Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Boîte utilisateur

and obviously the two next pages can be renamed as well:

Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Modèles/Requests > Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Modèles/Requêtes or Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Modèles/Demandes

Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Modèles/Subscriptions > Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Modèles/Souscriptions or Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Modèles/Abonnements

Many thanks. Trace (discuter) 19 octobre 2015 à 22:43 (CEST)[répondre]

Hi Trace, thanks for your help so far, and thanks for pointing out an important issue I had overlooked! It's easy for me to forget that it is not obvious how SuggestBot works, let me try to explain and point to how the various pages and texts that need translating relate to it. In both these scenarios, a user wants article suggestions from SuggestBot, the main difference is whether they want to subscribe and get suggestions periodically (e.g. weekly, monthly), or if they just want a single set of suggestions and not hear from SuggestBot until they ask again.

Scenario 1, A user wants to subscribe: This is described on Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Subscribe, and what users most commonly do is either add Utilisateur:SuggestBot/userbox to their user page, or Utilisateur:SuggestBot/config to their talk page, in both cases as a template (e.g. {{Utilisateur:SuggestBot/config}}). For both of these, there are two possible parameters, one to control how often they get suggestions ("fréquence"), and if they want the suggestions replaced instead of added as a new section ("remplace"). So if I want to subscribe to get suggestions posted weekly, I'll add {{Utilisateur:SuggestBot/config|fréquence=hebdomadaire}} to my talk page.

Once a day we run a program that checks for transclusions (I think the French term is "inclusions") of Utilisateur:SuggestBot/config. We take note of when they last received suggestions and make some calculations to see if we should send them suggestions. If so, SuggestBot grabs the user's edit history, using articles they edited to find articles to suggest. We then make an edit to the user's talk page with a substitution of Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Modèles/Subscriptions (i.e. {{subst:Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Modèles/Subscriptions|…}}) so it looks like the edit posted the whole message. This edit uses the edit comment listed in the first row of the table below in Configuration settings.

Scenario 2, A user wants suggestions, but not subscribe: This is described on Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Request, and what most users do is add Utilisateur:SuggestBot/suggest to their user talk page. Similarly to scenario 1, they add it as a template, e.g. {{Utilisateur:SuggestBot/suggest}}. This template does not have any specific parameters, if used as-is, SuggestBot will use the user's edit history as a basis for its suggestions. If the user instead wants suggestions based on specific articles, they can list them (e.g. {{Utilisateur:SuggestBot/suggest|Ordinateur|Programme informatique|Ada Lovelace|Alan Turing}}).

Every 5 minutes, SuggestBot looks for transclusions of Utilisateur:SuggestBot/suggest. It will then find articles to suggest, and make an edit to the user's talk page. In that edit it deletes the transclusion of Utilisateur:SuggestBot/suggest, and uses a substitution of Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Modèles/Requests to post the suggestions. Again the edit comment in the first row of the table below is used.

Sometimes a user will put {{Utilisateur:SuggestBot/suggest}} on their user page. If that happens, SuggestBot will also edit their user page to remove it, and use the edit comment in row 2 of the table below. Sometimes the only thing the user had on their user page was that reference to SuggestBot, so the bot's edit will create an empty page. We've had problems getting that edit to save correctly when the page is empty, so it will instead leave an HTML comment (i.e. "<-- a comment like this -->") with the text in row 3 in the table below.

Regarding your question about how to edit Utilisateur:SuggestBot/suggest, it uses {{Documentation}} so that it shows the documentation. The whole code on the page is this:

<noinclude>{{Documentation|User:SuggestBot/Request}}</noinclude>.

Similarly, Utilisateur:SuggestBot/config uses {{Documentation}} so it shows the documentation from Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Subscribe.

Hope this is helpful, please do ask if anything is confusing, there are no stupid questions! :-) Regards, Nettrom (discuter) 22 octobre 2015 à 02:10 (CEST)[répondre]

I decided to rename the pages using the first suggested translation, and set up the second suggested translation as a redirect. In the case of the templates I did not set up a redirect, as those templates are only used by SuggestBot as template substitutions, and therefore not seen by users. Tomorrow I will do some testing and submit the bot application. Cheers, Nettrom (discuter) 24 octobre 2015 à 20:33 (CEST)[répondre]

A few questions:

1. The "replace" parameter is a "yes/no" parameter, which I've translated into "oui/non", is that okay?
2. Do list articles on French Wikipedia always start with "Liste de", or are there other variants?
3. In some algorithms, SuggestBot filters out reverts based on edit comments. I've found two variants, one on the form "Révocation des modifications de (username) retour à la dernière version de (other username)", and one on the form "Annulation des modifications (revision id) de (username)". Are there others I should know of?

That's all for now. Let me know if there are any questions, and thank you very much for helping out with this! Cheers, Nettrom (discuter) 17 octobre 2015 à 19:50 (CEST)[répondre]

1. Oui/non sounds good to me,but "Accepter/Refuser" is better, I think.
2. "Liste de" is okay, but it can be "liste d'" if the word starts with a wovel, e.g. "liste d'articles" instead of "liste de articles", which is incorrect.
3. I do not know any other variant. But there are more things on heaven and earth, Horatio... :) Trace (discuter) 22 octobre 2015 à 22:41 (CEST)[répondre]

We can use both "oui/non" and "accepter/refuser", and thanks for pointing out that "liste d'" is also used! I have updated the configuration for both of these. Cheers, Nettrom (discuter) 24 octobre 2015 à 19:35 (CEST)[répondre]

Remplacer -> Remplacement

the second can be a boolean (oui/non) while the first one was not clear. I translated the other messages. — SF ^(d) 24 octobre 2015 à 20:08 (CEST)[répondre]

Mensuel -> Mensuelle + Bimensuel -> Bimensuelle: it is feminine (la fréquence) — SF ^(d) 24 octobre 2015 à 20:10 (CEST)[répondre]

SF, thank you so much for your help with the translations! I have updated the configuration, and also checked the documentation to make sure it is consistent with the configuration. Regards, Nettrom (discuter) 26 octobre 2015 à 17:24 (CET)[répondre]

 Like tears in rain, Scoopfinder, Simon Villeneuve et Linedwell : Suggestbot se rapproche de sa mise en service, mais il nous faut désormais traduire sa documentation (voir ci-dessus). N'hésitez pas à contribuer. Trace (discuter) 19 octobre 2015 à 22:46 (CEST)[répondre]

 Like tears in rain, Scoopfinder, Simon Villeneuve, Linedwell et Trace : SuggestBot is now ready for testing. If you add {{Utilisateur:SuggestBot/suggest}} to your talk page (or a page in your userspace), the bot should stop by with suggestions within 15 minutes. Until Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Modèles/Requêtes is translated, it will post in English, though. You can also subscribe (per instructions here), but that process is run once a day, so it will take a while to get the suggestions. Similarly, until Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Modèles/Souscriptions is translated, subscribers get their suggestions in English. Let me know if there is anything. Regards, Nettrom (discuter) 27 octobre 2015 à 01:11 (CET)[répondre]

 Nettrom : it works flawlessly! Impressive - and really useful. I'm amazed. I will translate the pages as soon as I can. Trace (discuter) 27 octobre 2015 à 08:38 (CET)[répondre]

 Like tears in rain, Scoopfinder, Simon Villeneuve, Linedwell et Nettrom : I've been looking at the sub-pages. They also need to be translated, I guess — mostly Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Souscrire and Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Requête.

I have a problem with the userbox: I can't find a translation that could use any of the three frequency parameters.

Let me explain it: in french, if you ask "What is the frequency?", the reply will be "mensuelle", or one of the others.

But if you ask someone to say when Suggestbot delivers it suggestions, he will naturally reply "Je reçois les suggestions de SuggestBot chaque mois", or "tous les quinze jours" or "chaque semaine".

No one would ever say "Je reçois les suggestions de SuggestBot de manière mensuelle". It could be "Je reçois mensuellement les suggestions de SuggestBot", "Je reçois bimensuellement les suggestions de SuggestBot" is really ugly, and it is the same for "Je reçois hebdomadairement les suggestions de SuggestBot".

I am far from being a userbox specialist ; is it hard to have the software matching :

• "mensuelle" with "chaque mois",
• "bimensuelle" with "tous les quinze jours"
• and "hebdomadaire" with "chaque semaine"?

It would be the best.

But if it is really needs lots of work, and if none of you has a better idea, I will use the sentence finishing with "de manière mensuelle". But for sure it wouldn't be the best advertisement for SuggestBot!

Best,

Trace (discuter) 28 octobre 2015 à 11:42 (CET)[répondre]

 Trace : Apologies for leaving this for a few days, I have had a busy week. Thank you for bringing this up! I understand how these single words would lead to sentences that are not French, so I appreciate your suggestions for improvement. If I understand you correctly, the userbox can start with "Je reçois les suggestions de SuggestBot" and end with either of the three listed phrases? Then, we need is to translate "mensuelle" into "chaque mois", "bimensuelle" into "tous les quinze jours", and so on? The reason why I want to translate a word into a phrase is that reduces the possibility of misspellings, so having users enter "mensuelle/bimensuelle/hebdomadaire" as a parameter to the userbox is preferred. This type of translation is easy to do since Wikipedia has the {{#switch: }} magic word, so I have updated Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Boîte utilisateur with that sentence and the phrases.

Thanks again, let me know if there's anything! Regards, Nettrom (discuter) 2 novembre 2015 à 02:02 (CET)[répondre]

 Nettrom : thanks to you. What is missing until we declare Suggestbot running in french? Subpages translations and? Trace (discuter) 2 novembre 2015 à 06:00 (CET)[répondre]

As far as I know, the only thing left to translate is Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Souscrire and Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Requête (I updated the table to reflect this). Everything else is ready, and the bot is running, so users can receive suggestions if they understand the English instructions. :-) I submitted a bot request yesterday as well, so other people know about it. Regards, Nettrom (discuter) 2 novembre 2015 à 18:53 (CET)[répondre]

 Like tears in rain, Scoopfinder, Simon Villeneuve, Linedwell et Trace : SuggestBot a maintenant statut de bot. Il y a encore deux pages qui a besoin de traduction: Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Souscrire et Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Requête. Mon français est encore élémentaire (j'écris cela avec un peu d'aide de Google Translate :-), votre aide sera grandement appréciée! Merci, Nettrom (discuter) 16 novembre 2015 à 17:57 (CET)[répondre]

Yes I know! I have been quite busy, but I still plan to work on it. But any help is welcome! Trace (discuter) 16 novembre 2015 à 18:33 (CET)[répondre]

 Nettrom et Trace : Today I had some free time at work, then I translated both pages. Do not hesitate to modify in case of need. Regards, Linedwell ^[discuter] 24 novembre 2015 à 14:43 (CET)[répondre]

 Linedwell : How nice you are! Excellent job! Thank you! I start to advertise for SuggestBot. Trace (discuter) 24 novembre 2015 à 14:55 (CET)[répondre]

 Linedwell : C'est fantastique, merci beaucoup! Nettrom (discuter) 25 novembre 2015 à 23:51 (CET)[répondre]

a suggestion: could you add a parameter to let know to @SuggestBot we'd like a regularly pass (weekly, monthly, etc ...) instead of deleting and re-ask ? thank you bonjour ! Sg7438 dring... dring, c'est ici ! 24 février 2016 à 13:24 (CET)[répondre]

Dans la spécialités poètes de l'Amérique du Nord, n'hésitez pas à me proposer des articles à améliorer, j'en ai repris plus d'une trentaine et créé une soixantaine...à bientôt Bernard Botturi 14 octobre 2017 à 23:22 (CEST)

Bonjour Bernard Botturi ! Je ne pense pas que ce bot puisse modifier les domaines des articles proposés, d'autant plus que ses concepteurs sont anglophones. Peut-être seriez-vous intéressé par le modèle {{Requête petscan}}, qui peut être posé dans une de vos sous-page, telle que user:Bernard Botturi/liste. Je vous invite à consulter la documentation du modèle pour plus d'informations. Cordialement --Framawiki ^✉ 15 octobre 2017 à 19:29 (CEST)[répondre]

Bonjour SuggestBot et SuggestBot ,

Pourquoi la boîte utilisateur "SuggestBot" n'apparaît-elle pas sur ma page Utilisateur:Contributeur2019 ? J'ai pourtant inséré le bon modèle, puisque vous m'avez répondu.

Merci et cordialement au dresseur humain. Contributeur2019 (discuter) 27 février 2021 à 16:36 (CET)[répondre]

Bonjour Contributeur2019 ,

Je vais attempter répondre en français :) Le modèle qui vous avez utilisé est pour demander des suggestions une seule fois, et SuggestBot a supprimé le modèle dans cette modification. La boîte utilisateur pour SuggestBot, c'est {{Utilisateur:SuggestBot/Boîte utilisateur}}. Nous avons de documentation ici, la boîte utilisateur et le modèle pour souscrire utilisent les mêmes paramètres.

Merci à vous pour utiliser SuggestBot! Nettrom (discuter) 28 février 2021 à 06:11 (CET)[répondre]

Bonjour SuggestBot . C'est parfait. Maintenant tout est clair . J'ai corrigé sur ma page utilisateur. C'est ok. Merci pour votre aide. Contributeur2019 (discuter) 28 février 2021 à 13:38 (CET)[répondre]